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 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions

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cowgirlwiththeblues
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:46 am

All the talk about the MATZ †songs improvement/ruining (delete as applicable) has made me think about the contrast between how the Gaslight songs are treated as compared to the MATZ ones. †

Brianís been very clear that the reason heís not playing Gaslight songs on the tour (with a handful of exceptions, completely on his own), is because he doesnít see them as his songs but theirs, he thinks all four band members are integral to them and it would show a lack of respect to treat them as part of his own repertoire. †Much as Iíd love to hear some of those songs, I have huge respect for that; I know he writes the basis of the song, but the others are a huge part of making them whole. †I think a lot of people who arenít musical donít appreciate that, and more to the point, a lot of singers and songwriters also donít appreciate that!

However, he has treated the MATZ songs as completely his own, recorded them with mostly different musicians and in some cases massively different arrangements. †Donít get me wrong, Iím not criticising this (I think those songs needed a proper outing) but it maybe shows that that band had a different dynamic and was more the beginning of a solo project than a side project. †Or maybe it was just a case of he really wanted to do those songs, and nobody else minded! †Interesting anyway.
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The_River
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 10:16 am

This record really makes me think a lot.
I like the new long drives, in a way that I like it as an "edit". A different take on the song, and I think the fact that it has been reworked heavily brings something new to the table. My favorite take on the 3 MATZ songs. I like the new lyrics a lot too.

I'm not really sure about the tracklisting, I would have done something way different. Mojo hand kinda breaks the groove between Honey Magnolia and Open All Night. Nobody Wins, Steve Mcqueen and Smoke would have worked better in that order. Foolish Things after Painkillers is weird to me. The transition between one feeling and an other are sometime brutal, and Mojo HAnd wouldn't feel like a gimmick if it wasn't at this exact order.

I'm kinda tired of Wonderful Life, I can't really spin it anymore. I don't hate it, but I've had enough for now.

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pleasepassthesoup
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:06 pm

cowgirlwiththeblues wrote:
All the talk about the MATZ †songs improvement/ruining (delete as applicable) has made me think about the contrast between how the Gaslight songs are treated as compared to the MATZ ones. †

Brianís been very clear that the reason heís not playing Gaslight songs on the tour (with a handful of exceptions, completely on his own), is because he doesnít see them as his songs but theirs, he thinks all four band members are integral to them and it would show a lack of respect to treat them as part of his own repertoire. †Much as Iíd love to hear some of those songs, I have huge respect for that; I know he writes the basis of the song, but the others are a huge part of making them whole. †I think a lot of people who arenít musical donít appreciate that, and more to the point, a lot of singers and songwriters also donít appreciate that!

However, he has treated the MATZ songs as completely his own, recorded them with mostly different musicians and in some cases massively different arrangements. †Donít get me wrong, Iím not criticising this (I think those songs needed a proper outing) but it maybe shows that that band had a different dynamic and was more the beginning of a solo project than a side project. †Or maybe it was just a case of he really wanted to do those songs, and nobody else minded! †Interesting anyway.

Maybe I'm misremembering this, but I'm pretty sure Brian has said that really the only reason MATZ existed was because the Bouncing Souls asked him to do Home for the Holidays and he didn't want to just get up there in that atmosphere by himself (Tim Barry did it this year and killed it solo, but that's just how Tim Barry is). So basically he didn't write those songs with MATZ in mind. He wrote them and then needed a vehicle to play the show with, so the band formed around the songs instead of vice versa.
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MKULTRA
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:30 pm

mingus wrote:
CapedAvenger wrote:

I can't have been the only one to spot the similarities between Mojo Hand and Sweet Morphine, can i?

Hm, for me it's Open All Night that takes me back to Sweet Morphine (that slide guitar!)

i think the slide guitar on Open All Night is much better. not just a "look, we have slide guitar" but actually a nice riff. i think Butch Walker did a great job producing this.
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riversedge
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:49 pm

Anyone actually have the additional tracks yet?
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ProMayhem
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 1:48 pm

Is these bonus tracks just a myth ?
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riversedge
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 2:43 pm

ProMayhem wrote:
Is these bonus tracks just a myth ?

lol think that they're delivered with the 7' set that hasn't been dispatched yet. booo.
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riversedge
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 7:34 pm

Digging Up the Dirt is one that I only just discovered.
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ProMayhem
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:10 pm

riversedge wrote:
Digging Up the Dirt is one that I only just discovered.

I'm yet to hear any of them
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riversedge
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:38 pm

Yeah, really itchy to see what they are like
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:53 pm

I really really like the album. I Wasn't overly impressed with what I had heard from the live versions and pre releases but it has massively grown on me since release.

I think it works best as a full album, a really great experience to listen all the way through (which Brian has always said is how an release should be best heard)

Have to agree with a few posters though, I definitely prefer the Matz version of Long Drives.

Can't wait to see him in London!
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Chobble
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Wed Mar 16, 2016 1:48 pm

Really diggin' the album...A few minor complaints:

- New version of Long Drives
- The vocal "harmony" at the end of Mojo Hand
- The positioning of Mojo Hand on the album
- Steve McQueen in general

Early favorites, per my voting on the poll:

- Painkillers
- Rosemary
- Honey Magnolia (100% respectfully disagree with those of you thinking the piano is unnecessary/out of place)
- Open All Night
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stephendgaf
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Wed Mar 16, 2016 3:32 pm

[quote="Chobble"]Really diggin' the album...A few minor complaints:

- Steve McQueen in general


Yeah, not good. Maybe I just don't get it, but easily the worst thing on the album.
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riversedge
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Wed Mar 16, 2016 5:46 pm

Don't really think there is a consensus on what is bad about the new version of Long Drives. Just seems to be a thing people are saying without reason
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Wed Mar 16, 2016 7:45 pm

riversedge wrote:
Don't really think there is a consensus on what is bad about the new version of Long Drives. Just seems to be a thing people are saying without reason

l like this version, but to be fair I never listened to the MATZ songs all that much so...
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riversedge
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Wed Mar 16, 2016 8:47 pm

I just really don't think it's that much of a shift to warrant such a strong response.
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Wed Mar 16, 2016 9:40 pm

For me the new verses aren't as good lyrically. It has an old timey country feel to it that I don't enjoy. It seems like a totally new song with the chorus and bridge plugged in. It feels much more melodramatic and generally lifeless. Those are just my thoughts. I mean everybody has their own opinions, obviously when people are very attached to a version of a song, it's hard to accept that it's not the same anymore. But when I listen to the two versions back to back they just seem to have a completely different essence to me, regardless of which you prefer.
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Wed Mar 16, 2016 9:52 pm

The original Long Drives didn't really fit in with the Molly and the Zombies feel either I love the original. I think it's more in line with a song like Break Your Heart in terms of an album feel. Since Painkillers was an Americana vibe, I can understand why Brian felt he needed to change the original, even if it was perfect.

Moving ahead though, only 7th and Union from the Molly days hasn't been recorded in some way for our ears. I feel like Sketchy and Lucky won't be revisited going ahead since the didn't make their way onto Painkillers.
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:14 am

riversedge wrote:
Don't really think there is a consensus on what is bad about the new version of Long Drives. Just seems to be a thing people are saying without reason

personally these are the things that bug me about it compared to the Molly version:

1 - its too slow and it makes the song drag
2 - i don't like the change of key that its in
3 - the high harmony in the chorus is way too high in the mix
4 - the effects on the electric guitar are strange and i don't think they fit very well
5 - the acoustic guitar is too low in the mix, the song just sounds like drums, bass and vocals in the verse
6 - i personally like the old lyrics much more
7 - the haunting rhodes is missing
8 - the desperate emotional feel of the original has been gutted
9 - the way "i could never get her to believe" is spoken sounds super cheesy

that being said, its still a good song and i do still like it, but to me it doesn't really hold a candle to the original. its a classic case of demo-itis for me, i grew way too attached the demo and short of just recreating it take for take with the new production i doubt anything would have held up to my expectations.
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Thu Mar 17, 2016 2:41 am

Well speaking of changes, after watching a live video of The Blues, Mary it seems like Brian tinkered with that as well. The essence is the same, but in addition to adding drums it seems like he cut the third verse "learned how to swagger...", and flipped the last lines of verse 1 and 2.
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Thu Mar 17, 2016 3:47 am

mja271 wrote:
Well speaking of changes, after watching a live video of The Blues, Mary it seems like Brian tinkered with that as well. The essence is the same, but in addition to adding drums it seems like he cut the third verse "learned how to swagger...", and flipped the last lines of verse 1 and 2.

That would be a bummer. Third verse is probably my favorite.
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:35 am

I really like the album and it's much more than I expected/hoped for. faves are foolish things, steve, rosemary, magnolia and open all night.
the clapping in the new version of smoke throwes me off, it's too much, it gives the song a nervous feel to it. otherwise it's a great song.
the only song I'm not too into is mojo hand, not bad but just not fitting.


can't wait to hear studio recordings of georgia and low love Smile
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:45 am

Honey Magnolia is such a good piece of songwriting, w/ piano or not.
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:55 am

I donít get the issue of the placing of Mojo Hand. Isnít it an unwritten rule of making records that if you have a silly/weird/fun throwaway track it goes second from last on the second side?
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PostSubject: Re: 'Painkillers' - first listen impressions   Thu Mar 17, 2016 6:52 am

Because it's not a silly song. It's a great song. And it pass as the silly song because of that. Like at 2:10 when it goes only acoustic, you can clearly hear that it's the drum pattern and the arrangements that make the song sound goofy, but the core of the song is totally not.
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