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 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012

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prettyontheinsidex
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:42 pm

I kind of get what you guys are saying about the fan club being like paying for songs that should be available to everyone. But, I think thats the whole point of having a fan club. Aside from getting access to presale tickets, which is a HUGE deal if you live in the NY area, there needs to be some reason to join and keep a membership. The whole point of a fan club is some kind of exclusivity. You want access to it, join. If you don't than your loss. It's not that expensive where it really burns a hole in your wallet. I've seen fan clubs that are much more expensive (linkin park jacked there's up to something like $65 after it was $20 or 25 for YEARS) and offered similar things. Let's be realistic, if you want those songs, you'll find them somewhere. it's not like they haven't been played live or anything and plus they're not super new or anything where you're really missing out. it's really only one new song.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:44 pm

FWIW-

if you want to hear desire played acoustically you can find other versions online, and halloween sounds to me like a demo that one would imagine will receive a better recording and wider distribution on a future album. i don't necessarily thing those that haven't joined the fan club are missing out, in the long run.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:45 pm

acousticbandit wrote:
FWIW-

if you want to hear desire played acoustically you can find other versions online, and halloween sounds to me like a demo that one would imagine will receive a better recording and wider distribution on a future album. i don't necessarily thing those that haven't joined the fan club are missing out, in the long run.

Exactly my point.
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ral
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:46 pm

kupe wrote:
"but it's the height of arrogance and greed..."

HAHAHAHAHAHA...Yes this is definitely that^^^ hahaha
Obviously sarcastic but it's dead on.

From the little I've heard about things regarding the fan club and from what Brian has said on stage, they will be lucky to break even on everything this year (and in all likelihood will lose money). It isn't run nor backed by Mercury. If anything, the label's not thrilled with the idea of something running outside their control.

CluckyB wrote:
Like I said, I have zero problems with the fan club vinyl exclusive. You're right that its just something cool you can add to your collection. The issue is that by calling it "Something special for the fans", you're implying that in order to be a "fan" you have to pay the $25 for the fan club. And that is silly and stupid and selfish. In order to be a "fan", the only requirement should be you need to like the music. I mean, Gaslight is my favorite band but I'm not a fan simply because I've never had a problem getting tickets so don't need the presale, have plenty of band t-shirts and don't really like to collect 7"s so I'd rather use my money to support them in other ways????

Give the people who give you money the t-shirts and vinyl they are paying for. But at the very least, let ALL of your fans buy your songs for the standard dollar a pop.

I really think you're reading way too much into this. The holiday single with exclusive songs is lifted directly from the Pearl Jam model from the 90s. It's outdated with the physical media but it is what it is. If there were no digital release, would you not have a problem with the songs being available on vinyl to only fan club members?
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:47 pm

Wow. If you knew me you would know that the vast majority of my posts on here relating to the band and the band's conduct are overwhelmingly positive. I just happen to take issue with the way that some music is being made exclusive to the fan club. At the end of the day I don't want to get involved in a slanging match with you over this. I just wish that you could have a bit more tolerance and debate an issue rather than just have a go at people because they have a different opinion to you.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:50 pm

I think the core of the problem is Itunes guys just aren't used to having an A-side not available to them at the click of a button, while the vinyl guys are used to putting in time and effort to get the records they want. One time it goes the vinyl guys way and people complain. Whatever, but the band didn't do anything wrong.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:55 pm

thebiglebowski wrote:
I think the core of the problem is Itunes guys just aren't used to having an A-side not available to them at the click of a button, while the vinyl guys are used to putting in time and effort to get the records they want. One time it goes the vinyl guys way and people complain. Whatever, but the band didn't do anything wrong.

I don't know who ultimately makes the decisions with these things so I am not necessarily blaming the band. It shouldn't be about 'iTunes guys' vs 'vinyl guys' either that's ridiculous. I think that the music should be available in both formats when possible. It's great that bands like TGA still record music on vinyl.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:56 pm

Christophe wrote:
Wow. If you knew me you would know that the vast majority of my posts on here relating to the band and the band's conduct are overwhelmingly positive. I just happen to take issue with the way that some music is being made exclusive to the fan club. At the end of the day I don't want to get involved in a slanging match with you over this. I just wish that you could have a bit more tolerance and debate an issue rather than just have a go at people because they have a different opinion to you.

Your posts were more balanced than the people before you. You just chose your side. and got lumped in with the others because I don't have time to debate every little line and all the differences of opinion individually.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:01 pm

thebiglebowski wrote:
I think the core of the problem is Itunes guys just aren't used to having an A-side not available to them at the click of a button, while the vinyl guys are used to putting in time and effort to get the records they want. One time it goes the vinyl guys way and people complain. Whatever, but the band didn't do anything wrong.
I don't think it's about sides but I agree with your point. I realize it's 2013 and people expect songs to be available digitally via iTunes/Amazon/etc but not everything is. More importantly, people aren't entitled to purchase individual songs just because they want them. That said, this release is like any other - if people want the songs, they will still be able to find them online.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:02 pm

Christophe wrote:
thebiglebowski wrote:
I think the core of the problem is Itunes guys just aren't used to having an A-side not available to them at the click of a button, while the vinyl guys are used to putting in time and effort to get the records they want. One time it goes the vinyl guys way and people complain. Whatever, but the band didn't do anything wrong.

I don't know who ultimately makes the decisions with these things so I am not necessarily blaming the band. It shouldn't be about 'iTunes guys' vs 'vinyl guys' either that's ridiculous. I think that the music should be available in both formats when possible. It's great that bands like TGA still record music on vinyl.

It was all the band's work. So you are criticizing them. It has nothing to do with the label.

Itunes guys vs. vinyl guys is an exaggeration used to make a point. We don't compete, and are all friends on here. The music is available in both formats, since I am listening to it on my computer and you will too.

The issue is that it seems like people feel entitled to have the right to music without any effort behind it at all. If it isn't in your desired format, do the best you can. Or better yet, buy a record player and listen to it in the format the band intended you to. Maybe that was part of Brian's intention (cause I know he has a record collection from an interview). If he came out and said that publicly, would you withdraw your criticism or still say "it should be on itunes"?
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:05 pm

Do you think the band will maybe put these songs up on iTunes after the vinyl is released? It was my understanding that we received these songs early because the vinyl wasn't ready for the holidays as they previously said it would be. Maybe they'll release the songs digitally after the vinyl is released? I mean it's only been one day since the fan club received the songs, I'm sure there will be other way to get them in the future.
I can understand why those who aren't members of the fan club are upset about not having a way to get the songs right now, I'm sure I'd feel exactly the same, but there's no way to know that the band won't be releasing these songs at a later date.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:09 pm

stepsandnumbers wrote:
Do you think the band will maybe put these songs up on iTunes after the vinyl is released? It was my understanding that we received these songs early because the vinyl wasn't ready for the holidays as they previously said it would be. Maybe they'll release the songs digitally after the vinyl is released? I mean it's only been one day since the fan club received the songs, I'm sure there will be other way to get them in the future.
I can understand why those who aren't members of the fan club are upset about not having a way to get the songs right now, I'm sure I'd feel exactly the same, but there's no way to know that the band won't be releasing these songs at a later date.

I'm not going to search for supporting statements from the band or fan club, but all intentions were to make this something for the fan club only. I am assuming it was by far the biggest draw from the package for most people, except maybe those who live on the east coast and have trouble getting tickets.

I am not positive there would have been a download if the records would have been delivered on time or if it was put together to keep people satisfied after the delays. I guess we won't know.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:14 pm

thebiglebowski wrote:
Christophe wrote:
thebiglebowski wrote:
I think the core of the problem is Itunes guys just aren't used to having an A-side not available to them at the click of a button, while the vinyl guys are used to putting in time and effort to get the records they want. One time it goes the vinyl guys way and people complain. Whatever, but the band didn't do anything wrong.

I don't know who ultimately makes the decisions with these things so I am not necessarily blaming the band. It shouldn't be about 'iTunes guys' vs 'vinyl guys' either that's ridiculous. I think that the music should be available in both formats when possible. It's great that bands like TGA still record music on vinyl.

It was all the band's work. So you are criticizing them. It has nothing to do with the label.

Itunes guys vs. vinyl guys is an exaggeration used to make a point. We don't compete, and are all friends on here. The music is available in both formats, since I am listening to it on my computer and you will too.

The issue is that it seems like people feel entitled to have the right to music without any effort behind it at all. If it isn't in your desired format, do the best you can. Or better yet, buy a record player and listen to it in the format the band intended you to. Maybe that was part of Brian's intention (cause I know he has a record collection from an interview). If he came out and said that publicly, would you withdraw your criticism or still say "it should be on itunes"?

When I can't find music on iTunes yes I do the best I can to get hold of it. (I still buy a lot of music on CDs too.) If Brian said that I would still say that I believe it should be on iTunes as well as vinyl. One of the main reasons for this is you can't put a vinyl record player in your pocket and I listen to music on my iPod all over the place. Maybe if I had the money and the will to buy a vinyl player I would. However at this point in time it's just not what I want to do. Like I said it's great that people collect vinyl (lots of those people are on this forum), however it seems, (and I'm not necessarily assuming this is what you think thebiglebowski) that some people think that you are less of a music fan if you don't religiously collect vinyl records. I buy a physical copy of as much of my favourite bands' music as I can and if I can't get it on CD I will buy it from iTunes.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:25 pm

Transportability is without question the biggest negative with vinyl.

I can only tell you what I do and assume that others do similar. We don't not listen to music when we run around. I have hundreds of cds I still listen to in the car. I keep music on my iphone. There are download codes inserted in albums. Or, even though it is technically not A-OK to do, we buy physical copies and just download the mp3s through other avenues, with a clear conscious because we still supported the artist. We listen to the vinyl whenever it makes sense to.

There are a ton of positives to it, too. One of which is that with Gaslight vinyl you can usually buy the first press, redeem the download code, put the record on ebay, doubling or tripling your money and legally obtaining the download for free. You are losing money by not collecting vinyl...
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:28 pm

thebiglebowski wrote:
Transportability is without question the biggest negative with vinyl.

I can only tell you what I do and assume that others do similar. We don't not listen to music when we run around. I have hundreds of cds I still listen to in the car. I keep music on my iphone. There are download codes inserted in albums. Or, even though it is technically not A-OK to do, we buy physical copies and just download the mp3s through other avenues, with a clear conscious because we still supported the artist. We listen to the vinyl whenever it makes sense to.

There are a ton of positives to it, too. One of which is that with Gaslight vinyl you can usually buy the first press, redeem the download code, put the record on ebay, doubling or tripling your money and legally obtaining the download for free. You are losing money by not collecting vinyl...

That last part is interesting. So you don't actually keep the vinyl? You receive it but get a download link, download it then sell the vinyl?
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:38 pm

No I have a copy of everything they put out, because it is my favorite band ever. I am just saying, that would work out fine. It's not just Gaslight either. That little trick works for tons of bands, some that aren't even super popular. I am not sure how being in the UK would effect it but as long as you were buying euro presses, it would. The collecting aspect of vinyl is frowned upon by many but just like any other collectible (comics, cards, etc), if you know what you are doing, you can make money. There's just no separating that anymore so I don't feel bad about using it to my advantage.

I have download codes that were never used and I just download the album through torrents. The reasoning is that A) the download is usually available before the vinyl is in my hands and I have no patience and B) its just easier and I have no fear of getting caught. Maybe now that they are on a major with lawyers and stuff backing them I should change things up a little but that is the future.

What I have done in the past is for example, sold multiple first presses of Sink or Swim (I had a black and a splatter), then bought 3rd or 4th presses because I don't care about colors. I was one of the first to sell the black on ebay so I got about $150 for it but now it goes for over $300 usually I think.

This record will almost cover the price of the club, if not sell for double it. Not an exact science. Just a prediction based on past information.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:40 pm

Vinyl really is my preferred listening medium and this 7" is going nowhere. No vinyl collector regardless of personal reasons for starting can be separate from the collectible aspects of it, though, which is just what I am trying to share.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:42 pm

Whoa reverb. Other than that, decent release.

And to those whining about it not being available on iTunes: quit complaining. We spent our hard earned money supporting the band with the Fan Club. The band decided we deserve two singles exclusive to us.

This doesn't make you less of a fan, but ultimately it's the band's decision and you should respect that.

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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:42 pm

That's interesting. Maybe it's something I will look into somewhere down the line. How come they attach a download code as well? That is basically two for one of the same album isn't it? Is it also true that the sound quality on vinyl is better than mp3 and CD?
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:58 pm

Christophe wrote:
That's interesting. Maybe it's something I will look into somewhere down the line. How come they attach a download code as well? That is basically two for one of the same album isn't it? Is it also true that the sound quality on vinyl is better than mp3 and CD?

From a label's point of view, you are buying the album and should kinda own it in whatever format you want. They don't really think "you need to pay us twice if you want vinyl and MP3s". However they can't say "just download it off the internet when you get your record" because this is legitimizing and supporting the pirates with the non-pirates. So they usually throw a little piece of paper with a download code in the record jacket, which allows you to get the MP3s. That's only been common practice for a couple years, though. I got a few cds in paper cases with some of my records, but older stuff is just a record.

I don't feel like I can do the final question justice, but it depends. Google it for a better explanation. There are different factors (was the album recorded in analog and pressed to vinyl, or was the record made from a digital recording? Is it being played on speakers intended for that use or little computer speakers? etc...). Usually people would say it has a "warmer" feel. But at best, it's close. You have to have a really nice system and really tuned ears to find a difference.

The truth is that for the majority of people, they justify it with sound quality, art size, the physical experience of flipping a record as something they enjoy, but deep down, they do it because they are collectors and enjoy the hunt.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 8:00 pm

I'm putting words into labels mouths, I guess. They probably would prefer it if all distribution was digital only and they had basically no production costs. But vinyl and download codes are demanded by their customers, so they fulfill those demands to keep them happy.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 8:13 pm

Halloween is such a perfect blend of Gaslight and The Horrible Crowes. I really hope the next album has more songs like it.
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 8:16 pm

Well I think next up is new Horrible Crowes so you should be happy
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:31 pm

DiamondSinatra wrote:
Whoa reverb. Other than that, decent release.

And to those whining about it not being available on iTunes: quit complaining. We spent our hard earned money supporting the band with the Fan Club. The band decided we deserve two singles exclusive to us.

This doesn't make you less of a fan, but ultimately it's the band's decision and you should respect that.


Why is this post worded so aggressively? No one's (well, CluckyB's gone a bit mad, but I dunno if I'd consider it whining) "whining" about the songs not being on iTunes. People (who are fans of the band) just want to hear the new songs (i.e., the music that they like because they are fans of the band). Why does the RPM club "deserve" the two singles so much? Does the money I spent on other merchandise not count because it didn't go to the RPM club, or, didn't "support the band with the Fan Club."

Sure, you guys getting the vinyl for free is a given considering the fact that you did sign up for the club, but why does that suddenly block the song out for everyone else? Why can't I pay $20 for the vinyl? Why can't I pay $1.99 for the mp3s? If the boys play one of the singles at a concert, will all the non-members be forced to shut their ears for 3 minutes?

Thirdly, why should we respect a decision that likely wasn't even made by the band? Why do we intrinsically have to respect the band's decisions anyway? If the band decides to take themselves down a hardcore gangster rap route, do I have to respect that decision simply because its theirs?

Hell, even if it's a timed release I'd be fine, but to make the songs themselves entirely exclusive to the band because your $25 went to a difference place than my $25 is ridiculous. I'm fairly certain the single will be on sale soon anyway, and even if it's not, it's bound to be available through "other" means.

It's really not that big of a deal, in the long run, since there's no doubt in my mind that they will be released. I just feel it's a bit unfair to generalize the "non-members" like that. Sure, CluckyB's a bit off the handle right now, but his feelings are simply grounded in the fact that he likes the band and wants to hear the songs in the format of his choosing.


Last edited by Matt L on Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:41 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: 45 RPM Club 'Album' 2012   Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:35 pm

thebiglebowski wrote:
It is whining. Mentioning that it is a Gaslight forum doesn't change that. You can and always have been able to whine about whatever you want on here.

How about the vinyl lovers who didn't get "She Loves You" or "Once Upon A Time" with their purchases? They might have said, "damn, I wish that song would have been included on the vinyl", which isn't whining at all. They didn't say "Why is Gaslight trying to exclude people who enjoy vinyl records. This is BS. Now I have to buy 59 Sound again in Itunes." They just listened to the song later on youtube or downloaded it, and enjoyed what they could through their preferred medium. That is the normal fan's reaction.

If they had forced you to buy the full album on iTunes I certainly would've complained. But they offered the extra songs for a dollar. Same thing we're asking for here.

acousticbandit wrote:
if you want to hear desire played acoustically you can find other versions online, and halloween sounds to me like a demo that one would imagine will receive a better recording and wider distribution on a future album. i don't necessarily thing those that haven't joined the fan club are missing out, in the long run.

Honestly its more of a matter of principle than anything else for me... I mean, sure it might turn up on a b-sides and rarities album at a later point but where is the harm in releasing it digitally now?

ral wrote:
I really think you're reading way too much into this. The holiday single with exclusive songs is lifted directly from the Pearl Jam model from the 90s. It's outdated with the physical media but it is what it is. If there were no digital release, would you not have a problem with the songs being available on vinyl to only fan club members?

Of course I'd still be annoyed by it. Its 2013. There is no reason to use outdated 20 year old business models. Especially if you are going to be playing the new songs live, I strongly dislike only letting fan club members legally get access.

thebiglebowski wrote:
I think the core of the problem is Itunes guys just aren't used to having an A-side not available to them at the click of a button, while the vinyl guys are used to putting in time and effort to get the records they want. One time it goes the vinyl guys way and people complain. Whatever, but the band didn't do anything wrong.

This has nothing to do with iTunes vs. vinyl. (That is an issue with the RSD release that is another can of worms I'm also kinda pissed about). This is Gaslight creating levels of "fanness" and only looking out for the people who give them money. Besides, I probably purchased 20 or so records on vinyl this past year so you can drop the elitist "iTunes guys" tone

stepsandnumbers wrote:
Do you think the band will maybe put these songs up on iTunes after the vinyl is released? It was my understanding that we received these songs early because the vinyl wasn't ready for the holidays as they previously said it would be. Maybe they'll release the songs digitally after the vinyl is released? I mean it's only been one day since the fan club received the songs, I'm sure there will be other way to get them in the future.
I can understand why those who aren't members of the fan club are upset about not having a way to get the songs right now, I'm sure I'd feel exactly the same, but there's no way to know that the band won't be releasing these songs at a later date.

I mean, we'll have to wait and see on that. But I haven't seen any indication that is going to be the case, and so am not sure why I should expect it.

DiamondSinatra wrote:
And to those whining about it not being available on iTunes: quit complaining. We spent our hard earned money supporting the band with the Fan Club. The band decided we deserve two singles exclusive to us.

This doesn't make you less of a fan, but ultimately it's the band's decision and you should respect that.

Why should I just accept any decision Gaslight makes without question? I mean, obviously its their choice to make. I can't sue them or stop them from doing it or anything like that. But isn't part of our duty as fans to call out the bands they like when they pull dumb moves? I mean, if they could charge $50 for their next album and I could be like "And to those whining about it costing too much: quit complaining. We spent our hard earned money supporting the band by buying the album. The band decided it should cost $50. Ultimately it's the band's decision and you should respect that!". But that's silly. If that were to happen I'd hope people would call them out for charging too much, and this really isn't that different.

I mean, I get it. Gaslight has gotten far, far more successful than most of their peers. The blueprint has run out. Making the right moves is hard and it's very easy to mess up. But I don't get why I get labeled as a villain here just because I have the audacity to speak up when they mess up. Hero worship serves no one.

And yeah, I know that if I wanted to find the new songs it wouldn't be that hard. But that's not the point. Gaslight apparently *wants* only the fanclub members to have these songs -- and that just, really sits bad with me.

*fingers crossed that this is all mainly just a misunderstanding and Brian puts the songs on Amazon/iTunes by the end of the week*
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