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 Brian on dinosaurs/evolution

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Jay
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:25 pm

I think the best way to understand something that we don't agree with is to find the reason behind the conviction.

Why do religious people believe in God? (A serious Question, I'm interested)
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:27 pm

Jay wrote:
I think the best way to understand something that we don't agree with is to find the reason behind the conviction.

Why do religious people believe in God? (A serious Question, I'm interested)
Upbringing, usually.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Sun Oct 16, 2011 12:01 am

Jay wrote:
I think the best way to understand something that we don't agree with is to find the reason behind the conviction.

Why do religious people believe in God? (A serious Question, I'm interested)

That could be (and is) a book but in short (and my opinion), a combination of the fact that we fear the unknown (thus crave an explanation to the questions religion answers about how we got here, where we are going, ...) and a fear of our own mortality (we want to believe that we can live forever in an afterlife).
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:34 pm

Harbortown wrote:
riversedge wrote:
So... any Atheists in the house?
That's a bit of a stretch.
I'm an atheist and believe there is no god. But I try to live a good life and think people should believe whatever they want.

Frank Turner sums it up well - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbUCzUk84fE :p
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Jay
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:30 pm

markbarlow wrote:
Harbortown wrote:
riversedge wrote:
So... any Atheists in the house?
That's a bit of a stretch.
I'm an atheist and believe there is no god. But I try to live a good life and think people should believe whatever they want.

Frank Turner sums it up well - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbUCzUk84fE :p

Agreed. It's great to have Frank around. Music has been lacking an articulate spokesman for atheists for way too long.
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Shrewsbury_Stars
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:07 pm

Jay wrote:
markbarlow wrote:
Harbortown wrote:
riversedge wrote:
So... any Atheists in the house?
That's a bit of a stretch.
I'm an atheist and believe there is no god. But I try to live a good life and think people should believe whatever they want.

Frank Turner sums it up well - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbUCzUk84fE :p

Agreed. It's great to have Frank around. Music has been lacking an articulate spokesman for atheists for way too long.

You mean, like, Bad Religion.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:42 pm

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:
Jay wrote:
markbarlow wrote:
Harbortown wrote:
riversedge wrote:
So... any Atheists in the house?
That's a bit of a stretch.
I'm an atheist and believe there is no god. But I try to live a good life and think people should believe whatever they want.

Frank Turner sums it up well - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbUCzUk84fE :p

Agreed. It's great to have Frank around. Music has been lacking an articulate spokesman for atheists for way too long.

You mean, like, Bad Religion.
God damn, I'm listening to Only Rain by Bad Religion right now as I'm reading that post.

Rain fell like judgement
Across my window pane
Said it fell like judgement
But it was only rain

Take that, theists!
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Harbortown
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:46 pm

Bad Religion aren't really advocating anything, though. They're just trying to motivate people to think for themselves.
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Jay
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 10:45 pm

I don't really listen to much Bad Religion so I guess that's why I forgot them.

It's just nice that somebody is so explicit about being an atheist without apologizing.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 10:53 pm

Harbortown wrote:
Bad Religion aren't really advocating anything, though. They're just trying to motivate people to think for themselves.

If you don't hear a constant undercurrent of atheism in BR's music, you're not listening hard enough.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 10:58 pm

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:
Harbortown wrote:
Bad Religion aren't really advocating anything, though. They're just trying to motivate people to think for themselves.

If you don't hear a constant undercurrent of atheism in BR's music, you're not listening hard enough.
Of course they've got songs about the concept of god and belief in general, but they've said themselves that they're not trying to represent a certain dogma or belief.

Also I'm the biggest fan of Bad Religion in the world so I've listened hard enough, thank you very much!
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Oct 20, 2011 11:10 pm

Harbortown wrote:
Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:
Harbortown wrote:
Bad Religion aren't really advocating anything, though. They're just trying to motivate people to think for themselves.

If you don't hear a constant undercurrent of atheism in BR's music, you're not listening hard enough.
Of course they've got songs about the concept of god and belief in general, but they've said themselves that they're not trying to represent a certain dogma or belief.

Also I'm the biggest fan of Bad Religion in the world so I've listened hard enough, thank you very much!

Just two quick examples of pro-atheism BR tracks.

Destined For Nothing

who do you believe can out some meaning in your
life? who do you conceive to provide you guidance
and light? Are they waiting for you in the by and
by? do you even have to try? headed for eternity
and destined for nothing the future isn't difficult
to see it's easy to confuse grand design with life's
Repercussions lament not your vanquished fanta-
sy it's only destiny why do you consent to live in
ignorance and fear? ancient people succumbed to
it, can it happen here? does it make you suffer,
'cuz you have to die? is it best to live a lie? why
can't you see, there ain't no destiny for you and
me?

Atheist Peace

Maybe it's too late for intellectual debate but a residue of confusion remains
Changing with the times and developmentally tortured minds are the average citizen's source of pain
"Tell me what we're fighting for"
I don't remember anymore - only temporary reprieve
And the world might cease if we fail to tame the beast
From a faith that you release comes an atheist peace
Political forces rent bitter cold winds of discontent
And the modern age emerged triumphantly
But now it seems we've stalled and it's time to de-evolve and relive the dark chapters of history
"Tell me what we're fighting for"
No progress ever came from war - only a false sense of increase
And the world won't wait for the truth upon a plate
But we're ready now to feast on an atheist peace

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Harbortown
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Fri Oct 21, 2011 12:24 am

Look, I'm not saying they're not atheists. I'm saying they're not spokesmen for atheism. There's a difference.
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Matilda Noir
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:38 pm

Debonair wrote:
If you read my whole post what I'm saying, is any topic, who are you to say someone shouldnt be allowed to believe what they want, if its not harming anyone, fine by me

I might think that your being stupid for not being reasonable when facts are in front of you, but who am i to say, I believe in stuff that others may disagree with

As the famous quote from voltaire says

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.

I agree with you, people seem to spend a lot of (wasted) energy obsessed with what someone down the street believes in or doesn't beleive in. If Brian is a Christian or not, it's not going to impact me listening to their songs. I'm a 'so called' Christian, if so and so next door isn't more power to him. I think if people spent more time worried about resolving their own problems and issues in life, they would have less time to worry about others and what they're doing.
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Debonair
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:50 pm

Matilda Noir wrote:
Debonair wrote:
If you read my whole post what I'm saying, is any topic, who are you to say someone shouldnt be allowed to believe what they want, if its not harming anyone, fine by me

I might think that your being stupid for not being reasonable when facts are in front of you, but who am i to say, I believe in stuff that others may disagree with

As the famous quote from voltaire says

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.

I agree with you, people seem to spend a lot of (wasted) energy obsessed with what someone down the street believes in or doesn't beleive in. If Brian is a Christian or not, it's not going to impact me listening to their songs. I'm a 'so called' Christian, if so and so next door isn't more power to him. I think if people spent more time worried about resolving their own problems and issues in life, they would have less time to worry about others and what they're doing.

Thank you

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nebraska
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Mon Nov 07, 2011 8:31 am

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steph
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:04 am

Harbortown wrote:
I think that not believing in evolution is kinda like not believing in the holocaust.

agreed. the reason is because there is as much proof of evolution as there is of the holocaust. meaning both are obviously true. anyone that tries to make more inflammatory claims is just taking advantage of the holocaust reference. just like when lennon said the beatles were more popular than jesus and people freaked the fuck out and twisted his words to mean that he thought the beatles were more important the jesus. which, either way, they were, hah.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:05 am

vamike wrote:
can't wait till someone proves the non existence of "god", till then, be afraid and believe in god if you must, I won't. and Harbortown is pretty much right Wink

ahh i love this quote haha.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:06 am

Casey wrote:
Bea wrote:
ok so he doesn't believe in evolution, what's the big deal? scratch

If you don't believe in evolution then you don't believe in education.

how can you argue with this point. agree agree agree!
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:09 am

loazis wrote:
The main 'problem' I have with the kind of religious people that would deny evolution, is that they live their life based on something that is based on nothing concrete and consequently I feel like they are by definition, at least to a certain degree, not open to reason.

I honestly have issues with the fact that the people that are running my country are seemingly unable to have a rational discussion about the very nature of our existence and the universe in general. I fear that I cannot take a person who thinks that events like the Ark of Noah (or who negate evolution) actually occurred too serious. At the very least, the thought of such people (and with such people I don't mean 'those bloody' Christians or Muslims or Jews or whatever; I mean people who ignore factual evidence and appear to prefer the unlikely explanations that some men wrote down thousands of years ago above the ideas and minds of our current age) making the decisions that govern our countries and ultimately the planet, I feel a little sad.

Just for the record, this discussion is apparently no longer about Brian's ideas.

the really scary part to me is that no one can be elected to a political position without declaring a belief in some sort of (b.s.) religion.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:52 am

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:
Harbortown wrote:
Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:
Harbortown wrote:
Bad Religion aren't really advocating anything, though. They're just trying to motivate people to think for themselves.

If you don't hear a constant undercurrent of atheism in BR's music, you're not listening hard enough.
Of course they've got songs about the concept of god and belief in general, but they've said themselves that they're not trying to represent a certain dogma or belief.

Also I'm the biggest fan of Bad Religion in the world so I've listened hard enough, thank you very much!

Just two quick examples of pro-atheism BR tracks.

Destined For Nothing

who do you believe can out some meaning in your
life? who do you conceive to provide you guidance
and light? Are they waiting for you in the by and
by? do you even have to try? headed for eternity
and destined for nothing the future isn't difficult
to see it's easy to confuse grand design with life's
Repercussions lament not your vanquished fanta-
sy it's only destiny why do you consent to live in
ignorance and fear? ancient people succumbed to
it, can it happen here? does it make you suffer,
'cuz you have to die? is it best to live a lie? why
can't you see, there ain't no destiny for you and
me?

Atheist Peace

Maybe it's too late for intellectual debate but a residue of confusion remains
Changing with the times and developmentally tortured minds are the average citizen's source of pain
"Tell me what we're fighting for"
I don't remember anymore - only temporary reprieve
And the world might cease if we fail to tame the beast
From a faith that you release comes an atheist peace
Political forces rent bitter cold winds of discontent
And the modern age emerged triumphantly
But now it seems we've stalled and it's time to de-evolve and relive the dark chapters of history
"Tell me what we're fighting for"
No progress ever came from war - only a false sense of increase
And the world won't wait for the truth upon a plate
But we're ready now to feast on an atheist peace


considering the proliference of religion in music, honestly, it's refreshing to hear a different point of view. and i don't even hardly listen to BR but i respect what they are trying to say. it would only be fair that their music/lyrics get as much play as that of the general pop music religious bs.
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PostSubject: Re: Brian on dinosaurs/evolution   Thu Nov 10, 2011 8:25 am

steph wrote:
just like when lennon said the beatles were more popular than jesus and people freaked the fuck out and twisted his words to mean that he thought the beatles were more important the jesus. which, either way, they were, hah.

haha, I love this!
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